A Wild Life: The Autobiography of Jackson Looseyia

0:00Jackson Ole Lucille is a distinguished Maasai field guide and conservationist based in Kenya's Maasai Mara. As a co-founder of the Mara Ripoi Conservancy, Mara Sianakamp and Tangulia Mara Camp, he has played a pivotal role in advancing community-based conservation initiatives in the region. His prominence extends globally through his participation in numerous acclaimed wildlife documentaries, including Big Cat Diary and Planet Earth by the BBC, Big Cat Legend by the Discovery Channel and African Cats by Disney. Through his dedicated work both in the field and on screen, Lucia has significantly raised international awareness of the ecological importance of the Ma Saimura and the urgent need to protect its wildlife. Simba Qiang Zhuo is a Chinese wildlife conservation explorer and a member expert of the International Union for Conservation of Nature, IUCN, based in Kenya's Ma Saimura. As the founder of several conservation organisations, He has devoted over a decade to field based ecological work, community engagement and the restoration of wildlife habitats.

1:29His extraordinary journey has been documented in numerous international films and features, inspiring Chinese communities around the world to take a more active role in wildlife conservation across Africa. On May 3, 2025, Simba Qiang Zhuo and his Maasai brother, Simon Masago, visited Tangulia Mara camp to meet with Jackson Ole Lucea and Dominic Encho, where they discussed strategies for advancing community-based conservation models in the Maasai Mara. Here is the story of Jackson Ole Lucea's remarkable journey from childhood to becoming a leading conservationist.

2:18As Maasai children, you grew up with, starting with a lot of responsibilities and when you grow up you'll be given a task to look after your sheep, your goats, your lambs, your calves. That's the first responsibility that I had as a kid and of course survive in the land That is plenty of buffalo, elephants, lions, hyenas. The lease is very long for all these animals that are very dangerous to children. I remember my first time to see a lion. Oh, my god. We were about to be beaten up by elders because we were not looking after our animals properly.

3:05And so I was so scared, so I ran. And all the way to the middle of the hills. And I saw six lions. I remember they were red, like Impala. And I almost died. I was being a small little boy, seeing lions for the first time. Actually, nobody believes me that I saw lions as I came back. I rather being beaten up than facing the lions. So I went back and got caught, got shortly shot. I was disciplined, and I went home. And then my first time also to see elephants, I was probably six, seven years old, little boy.

3:51And we saw elephants in the distance. They look like houses. And you know, pink kids, you see these things for the first time is just amazed by the sheer power and size of one animal. Soon after that, when we were transferred to go to school, now we learn English, we learn how to write and read. Over the weekends, we go and look after cows, sometimes hunting for little things like birds, small animals, as boys do. And that was also a learning process, Because that's when you learn about all different birds' names in Maasai.

4:36When you catch one, you can actually see the true colors of every single animal, and how beautiful they were. Even though it was kind of not right now, it was right at the beginning, because we were learning. We were starting to find out what is the name of this bird. about probably about 40 years ago of school finished school and I was just a herder at home I came across the tourist enterprises and this one gentleman gave me books and I'm looking just pictures that was the very first thing that the translate just pictures oh look at how colorful how beautiful it is But I know their names in Maasai, every single one of them.

5:32So I wrote first the Maasai names before I learned the English names. And I learned the English names within a short period of time. Within a year, I've mastered very well in English. And I was given another challenge, flowers. That was harder because the flowers are all written in Latin. So learn about the flowers, the Latin names. Yes, they moved to butterflies, they moved from there to trees, they moved from there to animals. Animals were pretty easy, because the harder part was now starting to learn about the taxonomy of every species.

6:15From the beginning to the end, what do they belong to, what families do they belong to, what order do they belong to, what species do they belong to. So, that was now the harder part of learning properly now to become a proper guide when do you now go through the scientific proper taxonomy of each and every species. You know, like the taxonomy of hair is so odd to find anything that is like a hair and rabbits. You know, they have a completely different story compared to zebra, so they have one stomach, compared to hippopotamus, compared to rhinoceroses, compared to elephants.

7:09So I started learning almost at a very early stage of my guiding career, and then I found My job in the tourist enterprise was given a job as a spotter and I work as a spotter. Sometimes I do night watchman, sometimes I did waiting on tables, sometimes I did maintenance, plumbing, digging, toilets, I did everything. did I know that I was actually trained on, I was on a college to train or prepare for my own enterprise. About 15 years ago I was given an opportunity to be a partner in the business for the first time. I didn't know what is a partner, what does it mean to own a business. I didn't know the responsibility involved, that you have to fix the toilet, You have to fix a tent, you have to know how to cook, you know how to guide, you know how to order, you know how to answer phone, you know how to write an email.

8:25A whole complete story of how it's done to become now a proper business person. So I partnered with some of my friends for about 13 years and we sold some of our business. That's when I saw money. And I knew owning a business is very important. So I saw real, real green money. And the real green money I can actually use now to buy my house, build a small house for my wife and my children. And I dropped my first car, it was an old Land Rover.

9:08I bought it at about $1,000. It was really beaten up. The story of my vehicle was driven from Cairo to Cape Town and came back to Nairobi, in 1965. Still have the long book. Pretty amazing. Owned by one person. And soon after that, the world of material, it was very interesting. You say you own a car, what is that, right? You own a house from living in a Maasai-Manyatta house to have a roof made of metal.

9:48It was the first miracle, but it was very noisy and cold. When it's raining, wow, you hear that, "You can't sleep. What is it going to stop raining so I can sleep?" During the day it was hot, hot, hot. You can't sleep, you go and sleep under a tree. That's the Maasai life of being brought up in life, because we don't actually live in houses. We live outside. The life of the Maasai is, your life is outside. you come and sleep in the house and you go out.

10:28So it was a very strange behavior to try and now change a lifestyle of living outside, to try and live inside, like you have a sitting room, you have a kitchen that you cook inside, you have a bedroom that you won't be sleeping inside, and even to have the worst, a toilet inside. You know, you're defecating inside your house, for us. No, that was taboo. You go and make a toilet in the bush, right? And the toilet paper is leaves.

11:09You take the leaves, you wipe your bottom, and you make sure that there are no insects. You get like that, you get the insects out. and and they were you knew which one was did not have fawns it's not the stinging nettle it's not going to rub your your anus and you'll be painful for a week and so we knew which one was right to wipe ourselves deodorant was you get the leaves like they say the leisure you put on your armpits that's our deodorant. Now to be able to get a roller and rub on yourself, I remember how the white people stink.

11:53They came with all these deodorant, sunscreen, and so on. And we hold our noses and say, "Oh, my God, these people stink!" And they smell. You go and get somebody with a soap. I think their first soap was sunlight and wax. So I remember the house, they smell terrible. I said, "Oh, this guy used the wasungu of the white people or the western world soap to be able to change your lifestyle to an extent that I can eat cheese." And that was probably the worst thing to eat as a massage. So first thing was cheese, was rotten, rotten milk. And then the next thing, you give them pork. No, you don't eat pork as a massage. You don't eat fish as a massage. You don't eat chicken. All these things, they are foreign food. Eggs. Really?

12:50You look at it. Yeah. Just run away. A lot of that has to be introduced to me now, you to run a business. Because if somebody from my business says the food is terrible, what is actually terrible? We're growing up drinking milk and blood. So to have a bad egg, I have to know, why is it terrible? Why is it bad? We're not used to this anyway. And so I change that slowly by slowly adapt to that but with the help of me traveling, you know I started traveling the first time it was 1992 I went to South Africa and then I came from South Africa I went to England 1994 I came from England I traveled 1990s I think 97 for the first time traveling to the US all these traveling have translated so many things experiences for me to learn what is actually it means for a western person to be comfortable in my own venture. So in my camp that I own with other partners now I can understand what is the meaning of being comfortable in the bed, grew up sleeping in a skin with wood and leaves and we were very comfortable with the first time to sleep on a mattress. It was difficult. You cannot sleep. It's too comfortable and you try to sleep, you're sinking and you say, "How do you sleep in this thing? It's too soft and now if I go and sleep on a skin for the last two days or three days. I can't sleep. It's too hard. I'm running a hard side role like this. It's hard and in two or three days I will get used to because I grew up in that kind of life and so I totally started to understanding in the tourist enterprise that there is a hard mattress, there is a middle, medium and there is a soft. Some customers prefer soft, some customers medium some customers hard so you have to also understand what is a pillow before you use your hand and use wood you put on your head you sleep and you sleep very well and to be able to say there is a pillow and this pillow is soft you know the western world is so spoiled I need a feather pillow I need I don't know this particular material pillow to this we use wood so what's the deal with having a pillow of a different kind but that comes with the business soon after that I became a very professional guide you know my business now is sold to some other business people and I went traveling all over Africa, learning about different geographical countries, learning about species, why is it matters for conservation, for wildlife and so on.

16:12Why? What's the meaning of it? I actually realized that preserving wildlife and conservation can give me a better name and better satisfactorily because I'm preserving an animal that has no parent, no father, no lawyer, no nothing. And I've seen in my life, abundance and abundance of wildlife, from the migration going through the duster of my home to zero, to sleeping here in lions every single night, to none. Now we barely hear hyenas in our own villages.

16:52Of course the population of my community have grown, demanding more land. We also change a lot of lifestyle for being passed through this pure to be cultivating land. You know, you have to venture through different lifestyles. As a country progress, where I can call that progressive or just a different lifestyle, I would rather call it a different lifestyle than progressive. Progressive to me is preservation of what is unique to your country and only. Lions, wildebeest, zebras, and many many other other species are only found in East Africa. Forget about Africa. And if I could be part of that, that would have been a great thing. So conservation started many, many years.

17:53So because I was part of the camp, I had the privilege to attend to a lot of meetings, decision-making, negotiation with the communities, with the elders, with the chairman of group So I had a lot of privilege on that, and that grew also my network and respect. You have to believe money is king. You have to accept that. If you have money, you can open a lot of doors. And because I was a businessman, I can attend a lot of meetings that most of my colleagues and same-age mates would not, Because I can attend from the local to the government, to the international.

18:43I've attended a lot of international meetings, you know, talking about one life of outsourced resources to give back into conservation. I remember my first big challenge of conservation, it was during 9/11, that's 2000. What is it? 19, 2011. What's that? 9/11. It was, yeah, it was on the 9th, on the 11th date of September, when the World Trade Center was attacked by tourism. It was bombed, correct. That was 9/11. There were no tourism including my camp that was effectively happening in the Mara. We were solo, every single person was solo and that affected the parks and national reserves. So I went to climb Kilimanjaro to raise money for the Mara Triangle. So So that's when they made me an honor rewardant, Kenyawala Service Honor Rewardant, and Mara Conservancy, Mara Triangle in the Mara Game Reserve, they made me an honor rewardant.

20:08Of course, I raised not a lot, $20,000, and $20,000 will pay a lot of money, a lot of food to a lot of people. So I went to the social media and I asked people to sponsor me, to Client Kilimanjaro, Painful was hard work. Couldn't breathe, couldn't think straight, couldn't sleep at all at night, and it was damn cold, all right? Hard, hard, hard. But every single step that I took, I said it was for conservation. It was for conservation.

20:48I needed the lion to survive. I need the rhinos to survive. I need to do this to survive. And I made it to the very top. the hardest thing I've ever done in my life. The coldest I've ever, ever been in my life. I actually burn permanently my feet, permanently. Even now, I cannot feel cold. I cannot feel, I cannot feel my feet, my toes and under my feet. I can walk on rocks. I can just see bleeding. I can walk on anything, but anywhere cold. If I go to any cold area, like I went to about two years ago, I went to Seattle, and I went to Minneapolis, I was like on fire because I had an expert, somebody who had gone to the Himalayas, and I took my shoes and he looked and he said, "You're not going to lose anything.

21:45"Your tissues are burned permanently, forever." 'Cause they were white. And so be careful any time when you go to any cold place because you could hurt yourself because you won't feel it. But now I feel very hot, hot, cold, cold. But anywhere I can walk on phones, I don't feel because I did that. And I burn myself, preserving and protecting what I believe in. So story short, after that, I went to do my freelance. And that's when I met Dominic, my business partner. We were kids in school together.

22:26We worked together as we went to better schools, very highly educated. He wanted to work for the government. I went onto the other side, and I walked into the private sector. And then he realized that working in the private sector is more profitable than working in the government. So he dropped his job and he sat in his meeting. - More freedom. more freedom, more thinking, critical, very independent. So he started a small little camp called Numbu. And I remember he came to buy one of our Land Cruisers. We are disposing an old Land Cruiser. That's what he can afford. He brought a lot of money. I don't know how much was that.

23:06Was it about a million or 800,000? What? The money you bought to buy K.A.G. Oh. Remember, you bought that car. you brought a lot of money to us. That was about $600,000. There was a lot of money by then. That was 2006. Yes, a lot of money. He came with a bag. It was almost $800,000. $800,000. Almost a million. And that's a lot of money. So we saw this massa carrying money in his bag and he's, you know, counting and giving to us. by then I sit on the board and we said to my businessman this is love man let's go and buy another car we top it up we bought another new car he took an old Land Cruiser and it was suitable for him and it was suitable for us and that was the first time he came started now seeing me as a as a good example and a mentor in the tourist industry and so we joined him in 2015 2016 We studied our own very first ever Maasai business and that's what the success story of from there is, that is its history.

24:20We learn how to build terms, we learn how to do planning, we learn to cry, we learn to argue. Business is not a straightforward line. You go like this, oh, this is not right. We go like that. Clients are complaining. We change. We do this. Clients are not happy about that. We charge more. We attract different clients. We charge more. We attract even more different clients. And then we have to hire professionals who work for us so we can be free to do marketing. We go to the states together. We go to South Africa together. We go to all over the world marketing our business.

25:02and so that's how we became to come to where tabuia is right now and I'm still doing more businesses and I will continue to do more businesses because I realize that's where the decision-making is. If you're just employed, well you have a limit but if you have your own enterprise you can close it down if you choose, you can expand if you choose. You can take risk of loans if you choose. Like you know our vehicles here, we got to the bank, we took risks and we took big loans and that gave us a way of growing.

25:44Hard when you're paying, but when you finish, your your mark is grown up, your net worth is gone up and so you always think of what are you worth now your net worth is what when you continue now growing your business father and father so why do you often emphasize on community and wildlife conservation whenever you do business you know when the when you do business and you do conservation they go hand-in-hand the reason why they're important people come here to view the wildlife and they come here because of the community the two of them works together but the land is the kingpin because what life need land community need land. So the land management is the most important part of conservation. If you have land that is not protected properly, and the community are not benefiting properly within that same land, how do you conserve the wildlife? When people are living in poverty, when people are being a target and getting nothing, you have to know a very good example.

27:07Wildebeest has made East Africa, Kenya and Tanzania, and people will go for the gorillas and chimpanzees in Uganda and Rwanda, but first they come on safari. So the Wildebeest have made East Africa, take a very good example, but they have one disease that kill our cows, it's called malignant catar, it's a virus that lives within the embryo of a newborn wildebeest, when the cows go and graze with the wildebeest and they get their after bath or whatever that the virus is attached to the grass, they die and there's no cure.

27:48You could be your favorite bull, you've only cow that gives you milk for your children and your family, but you will die and there's no compensation, right? So if the community are not benefiting from these animals, we are always the people who suffered the most. You host these elephants, they killed their relatives, they killed their children, come on to school, it's not all happiness living with these animals. There is another side that a lot of people don't know. They only know this good side, preserve them, look after them, make sure that they continue surviving. Yes, with us, they are lions and they eat us.

28:31And they're hyenas and they eat our goats, right? And they eat our sheep. These animals can be a menace. So the community, because they have such an impact on that, it is so important that there is a benefit that goes towards the community from the preservation of wildlife. And that has given me an opportunity being in business because you cannot do anything without business. If you don't have money, then you'll be relying all the time on somebody to donate, somebody to donate. And donations sometimes are not the best way to fund conservation.

29:12You need conservation to begin with the donation, but ending up with being sustainable itself, protecting itself, making sure that the returns coming from the park conservation fees going back to preservation of the wildlife 100%. That will free the donation to preserve more area and to open more areas for conservation and wildlife preservation. But the business is the only thing that can do that. At this point, I would say the number one business that we know is tourism. But tourism can lead to many, many other things. Tourism, the tourists need to shower, they need clean water, they need transportation, they need food and not one kind, many, many kinds. If the community can tap into that, they can benefit more from the industry that is within their doorsteps. That's one area that has not been explored properly. And with the investors that are there, they can be tapped for other parts like hospitals, good health care, the vets that are looking after the wildlife can be translated to be looking after our domestic. A vet is a vet, a cow or two, a cow, like a buffalo. So it's the same principle, right? Our dogs are like our jackals. So the vet who take care of the jackals can easily take care of the dogs. And so it can be tapped in both ways so that the community does not get impacted.

31:13Just for the sake of we want to preserve animals, we want to preserve wildlife, we want to preserve nature. Nature without community will not work. Community, nature and wildlife will go in hand. And that's the message that you need to be told to everybody around. Thank you. So there are lots of safari destinations in Africa. When people talk about safari they will think of Maasai Mara. So can you make a brief summary about Maasai Mara? You want to say to international tourists why they should go to Maasai Mara?

31:57When people think of safari, Maasai Mara come at the very, very top of the pyramid because We have very, very high species and numbers. Everywhere else you go, the numbers are down. Maasai Mara, you are actually guaranteed to see lions, hippopotamuses, crocodiles, hyena, elephants, and many, many other animals. If there is a place that one tourist want to visit once in a lifetime, Maasai Mara is the destination. - Okay, I can see you attended many documentaries by BBC, Discovery, and other TV channels.

32:49Whenever you talk about white animals, you feel like very excited, very passionate. You know, most of my people, they are labors to animals. So they don't show very big curiosity about animals. Why are you so passionate about wet animals, especially big cats? I'm passionate about the wild animals, particularly the big cats, because to be a conservationist, you've got to learn more about what actually is managing conservation. If I can summarize lion, hyena, leopard, cheetah in that order, they're all predators and they are fewer in number.

33:38But they are the managers, they are the very top. At the very top you go the lion, and then you have the hyena being number two. The hyena can dominate a leopard without a problem, and a leopard can dominate a cheetah without a problem. but actually they're the one who are managing our conservation. Without the big hats, everything falls. They are the checking and balances of conservation. That's why I get excited about it. They are also family. You get a pride of lions. They will be a father, they will be mothers. It's like our culture. We have a father and have got many wives.

34:19So what's wrong with that, right? So that male lion is the head of the family. And that family organ is the transformation of the species. You see the babies, they are playing, they are happy, they're very resilient. It's what an incredible story just to watch how the lion life as a family is like. It's no different to our life and our species and how we do life back in the village. You have the elders, you have the mothers, and you have the children that are all protected by the head of the family. I'm pretty excited. I cannot speak well enough about the predators.

35:04- Very good. I'm very curious about, you didn't go to college to learn the environmental science, biology, or conservation biology, or ecology. But when you talk about whether animals, especially big cats, you are very professional. You can talk a lot and very vividly. You know more than those professors, most professors, or the researchers. So why is that? You know, conservation, and being born a conservationist is a gift.

35:49And you have to understand one thing. Where we are is a very big school, is a very big college. We see everything right here, from the weakest to the strongest. The most resilient to the most fragile. And you can learn that while you are on the field every single day. If you have a curious mind like I have, there is no doubt whether you become a professional or not. Because you're looking at it, why did that happen? Why did the lion left to the cubs unattended today?

36:31And there's so much danger. Why did the leopard cubs can survive on their own for a week without the parent? and I'm there every single day and I'm actually taking notes myself, just follow them, follow them and I'm learning why, how do they survive, then you'll learn that. That's exactly the same data a scientist take when he's sitting, he's taking this in data, oh, and then he goes back to the milk, he probably will go and milk a leopard and put into the lab and finding out how rich and how long to sustain a cup. I don't do that because I don't have the equipment to be able to do that but what I can do I can observe and I can learn and I know exactly how it goes. Animals are very spiritual and it's one of the sides that scientists don't have. You don't have that connection, spiritual connection of I can feel the animals, I can feel the lions, I can feel the energy of a leopard, I can feel the I'll sit there, and my emotions of that animal is like a connection, and all the time I can even predict what they're about to do.

37:45I just sit there and say, "This animal is just about to do something. This animal is hungry." You can predict. "I can predict a lot of what is about to happen with animals. I become an expert on that field." and and it's because I put a lot of time I remember one time I actually did filming for 90 days and I leave by about five o'clock and I come back at about eight o'clock non-stop every single day that's tiring that's hard right sometimes I can do for a whole year and every single year every single day for a whole year I will probably have a break off about a week a month and I'll go back again and I start again from where I left and continue. The moment you put a lot of time into a particular species the more actually you become closer to it you become an expert and you learn a lot more and and the animals can teach you their behavior will teach you and and you learn a lot from the behavior of these animals have to know we are also animals we're not angels we are animals just like them we just behave differently we think differently but we are animals and and so that is how I became an expert on the field and many researchers or professors scholars they learn from books or paper work thesis you learn from the ground from the field you follow animals yeah spend a lot of time following them and learn from them then them behaviors then you know how to predict the behavior so do you have any suggestion to tourists when they encounter with the fierce animals like elephants rhinos hippos lions yeah my My advice to international travelers, people who come to Africa and observe and probably want to learn about animals, behavior number one, make sure you have a really good guide who understands the behavior of animals.

40:08Don't push. If you come to East Africa, Kenya, Uganda, Tanzania, or South Africa, there is no time that you can push that guide to produce a better photo for you, all right? Make sure you respect that animal 100%. What is the behavior of that animal? Let the guide translate to you, because majority of those international travelers, they want a good photo. They want to see a lion with big teeth. They want to see a rhino charging. They want to see an elephant charging so they can have the excitement and adrenaline. We don't want that. it's not about adrenaline. It's about respect. You are in a sacred place. This place is sacred.

40:55It is treated by our life and the nature to be as calm as possible. In most cases, where I have been charged, it's very, very often it's my fault. I might have brought too close, I might have gone too close to the cubs, and the mother is not going to be happy. I might have been close to lions who are mating. Well, that husband is not going to be happy. I've invaded their space. So, the majority of the time that I've seen aggression in animals, it is very often, and most of the time, it's a fault of the guide. As a guide, I would even say to the guides observe behavior, behavior of the animal that you are carrying in the car and the animal that is going to be observed and photographed by the animals that are in the car. Right? The animals that are photographed there and the animal that you are carrying, you must take care of both. None of them deserve to be killed. None of them deserve aggression.

42:09None of them is clever You are the trained professional. You are the clever person make sure you sit in the middle You see the future because any of the tourists that will get hurt Will still hurt your profession and your business and your business employer Any of the animal that will be hurt as a result of your reckless behavior you have diminished a life, it could be a mother, it could be Elsa, it could be an elephant with a baby, it could be a leopard or a lion or a cheetah with a baby, trade with care all the time.

42:56Let's go for dinner. What do you think of the international cooperation? No country can work alone because we are facing global issues, challenges, threats together as global citizens, like climate change, environmental pollution, biodiversity laws, human life conflicts. How do you view international cooperation to tackle with all the challenges? One of the things that I've observed as a child, as an elder now, as a professional up in my field, earth has become small, it is a village, it's no longer the thinking of having borders. Where are the borders? The borders are gone and people have to understand that we together in the cooperation, in the international countries which call themselves countries with borders and passports, we have only one planet, one that support life, it's Earth. And if we mess up Earth, we, regardless of your business, have nowhere to go. We have nowhere to live. We have nowhere to produce and continue the species of humanity other wildlife species. When you look at every single thing and every movement that you make, being in the water, river, lake, ocean, forest, mountain, ice, there is all life everywhere, even in the sky, within earth. We have nowhere else that has got such an abundance of life and if we destroy because of cooperation because of greed with making more money because of chemical because of whatever that you may think of could be mining could be whatever I I don't care what you do do it with a lot of care and responsibility to make sure that you preserve our planet Earth because we haven't got another one like it.